Beyond w/Timecode?

Discussion in 'PangoScript, Universe and Midi Templates' started by Tim Walsh, Jun 8, 2012.

  1. Tim Walsh

    Tim Walsh Active Member

    What is the preferred method to use Beyond with time code? I want to sync it with a client's fireworks show. He can use SMPTE 30 with his firing software. I have an old Aquila I used with Showtime - can I use it with Beyond? Or order the TC2000 - that should work, right?

    - Tim
  2. Pangolin

    Pangolin Staff Member

    Right now, BEYOND does not support timecode, regardless of the device used. We deemed this less important for the initial release of BEYOND because of our observation that these days, most people are doing multimedia shows where the other medias (such as audio and video) are also sourced from the computer and played back along with BEYOND itself.

    I'm not sure that BEYOND will support timecode by the time version 2.0 rolls out, which we hope to be around mid-July.

    With that being the case, your client will have to use the LD2000 series for anything timecode related. Note that they can still use BEYOND for live portions of the show, and even have BEYOND minimized while LD2000 and Shwotime are playing, as long as "Enable Laser Output" is not pressed while BEYOND is minimized and LD2000 and Showtime are running.

    Best regards,

    William Benner
  3. Hektek

    Hektek Beta Tester

    Tracking timecode is an important feature for recording portions of shows to HD24, and tracking along with other equipment at installations where laser effects chasing along with a major show control system such as MediaLan. So I wanted to voice my support of trying to move it higher on the "to do" list.
  4. firstlight

    firstlight Beta Tester

    I'll chime in for timecode being necessary as well. Very rarely in a professional level show are video and lasers played back on the same computer. While there are other ways to sync, SMPTE is still pretty much the norm, especially on most corporate shows and installations.
  5. aricha

    aricha Well-Known Member

    Same here

    Maybe ArtNet and midi is the future but I don't know if video guys or the lighting designers/programmers master those options

    I guess it is time for me to learn more about midi and ArtNet
    any suggestions about ArtNet Basics Literature?
  6. Koja

    Koja Beta Tester

    From my experience over here in Europe, SMPTE-timecode is the standard. It's only the few laser-only shows that are run directly, but all bigger shows are preprogrammed and also include lots of lighting, sound and video that is all synced via SMPTE.

    But you don't have to deal with SMPTE in Beyond, just use MIDI-timecode which is probably easier to do for you. There are lots of cheap devices out there that convert SMPTE to MIDI timecode in realtime, I've been using many of them already for other purposes.
  7. ZenithPyroLaser

    ZenithPyroLaser New Member

    SMPTE --> Beyond

    I agree with Koja,
    I work with many high end live productions and many live Television productions use SMPTE to sync camera switchers, lighting, pyro and lasers.
    I feel it is a key element to make part of Beyond.

  8. Martin Kapp

    Martin Kapp Active Member

    I agree that this is essential for me and my clients (Bill - you know who).

    It means that I will be forced to continue to use ST for the foreseeable future.
  9. Pangolin

    Pangolin Staff Member

    Hi guys,

    We thank you for your response. Up until now, we have placed a low priority on timecode. Really most shows for most of our clients (now more than 22,000) are done directly. I will also point out the ILDA conference itself, where there are many shows ran for lase-off or awards, not a single one with timecode.

    Nevertheless, we do recognize that timecode is important for some people, and so we have spent some time on this within BEYOND. As with everything else that we have done so far, the timecode capability of BEYOND is superior to that in LD2000. Moreover, we support timecode not only from SMPTE but also communicated through Artnet and other network-related sources.

    This version is still under development but it is coming along quite nicely.


    Setting this aside, we want to once again layout our goals for development. Our goal is that we provide tools -- a complete set of tools for laser show designers. Our goal is NOT that we embody every single laser show creation technique into a single tool. Rather, we prefer the "toolbox" analogy.

    The LD2000 is one tool in the box. BEYOND is another. Clients are free to use the best tool for the job. Sometimes the best tool will indeed be LD2000, and other times it will be BEYOND.

    Best regards,

    William Benner
  10. Laser Ed

    Laser Ed New Member

    Using both LD2000 and Beyond together.......

    I will have to completely agree with what William Benner says below. I just got done tonight doing my very first full show using Beyond at our Radio Active Laser & Video Immersion Show at the Noble Planetarium in the Fort Worth Museum of Science and History (Texas.)

    I used Beyond with an APC40 board chock full of abstracts (thank YOU Mike Dunn!!!) But during the development of the cues, I used LD2000 (which is where Mike's abstracts resided.) In some cases, I made some short sequences with multiple abstracts in Showtime on a timeline, and then selected the output to go to an ILDA animation file.

    Taking the animation then into Beyond allowed me to do many other things with it.

    So in short, in my case, LD2000 helped with providing some "ingredients" to use in Beyond for a live show. They work quite well together !!!!

    If you are in the Fort Worth area on the next two Saturdays, come and check out the show...7 and 8:30 pm. Full dome custom designed video projected visuals (pre-rendered) and live lasers with Beyond.


    Laser Ed

  11. Pangolin

    Pangolin Staff Member

    Timecode now works in BEYOND. Currently BEYOND supports SMPTE/MIDI devices (not the TC2000 or Aquila yet).

    I just wanted to let you know...

    Also, Laser Ed, you didn't need to export from the Showtime timeline, at least not for abstracts. BEYOND fully supports LD2000-style abstracts, as well as two other types of abstracts.

    Best regards,

    William Benner
  12. Astatic

    Astatic Member

    Great news!
    But i read the TC2000 is smtpe, which device should i need to get this to work if the TC2000 isn't compatible?
  13. ZenithPyroLaser

    ZenithPyroLaser New Member

    I have the same question as Astatic, since I have a TC2000 on the way to us.
  14. Astatic

    Astatic Member

    I've send an e-mail to Pangolin to get this clear, i want to use timecode but what hardware is working.
  15. Koja

    Koja Beta Tester

    I did sucessfully use an old Steinberg SMP II (1U Atari Smtpe-Midi converter from the 90s that can convert the timecodes standalone) and a USB MIDI Interface for my initial tests with Beyond and Timecode and now use a "MOTU Micro Express USB" ( That is a USB MIDI Interface that can also read SMPTE.
    If you want to use use MIDI Timecode (MTC), any of the cheap MIDI-Interfaces from ebay will do the job.

  16. Astatic

    Astatic Member

    Thanx Jan!
  17. ZenithPyroLaser

    ZenithPyroLaser New Member

    Thank You Jan as well...
  18. Flyingpictures

    Flyingpictures Beta Tester this

    Hi, I can confirm this works.. Run Beyond ver 453b or later
    1/ Set up IPmidi on the network/local LAN
    2/ run Vegas Video to output MTC as video plays
    3/ In Beyond config, set Timecode to Timeline and enable MTC
    4/ Set Midi devices to listen to 01 Ethernet midi
    5/ Make sure timecode is enabled for the show, match SMTPE rate eg 25fps
    6/ Play video in vegas, Beyond chases it..
  19. Pangolin

    Pangolin Staff Member

    We're also working on support for the older Aquila and TC2000 as well. Stay tuned folks... In the mean time, just use a SMPTE/MIDI device, and actually those will generally give you much more utility anyway...
  20. pyroglenn

    pyroglenn Beta Tester

    at this moment you can only use mtc code to trigger beyond but you need ver 552,you can use something like the motu midi express feed it with smpte then it will send mtc to the beyond computer via usb